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Poker Machine Reform

Published on: June 2023

Record: HANSARD-1323879322-132315

Poker Machine Reform

Debate resumed from 1 June 2023.

Ms JENNY LEONG (Newtown) (14:31:34):

By leave: I move:

That the amendment of Mr Harris be amended by omitting all words after 'That' and inserting instead: 'this House recognises that every member in the Parliament has a responsibility to act to end gambling harm and money laundering.'

If my amendment is agreed to, for the clarity for everybody watching at home, Mr David Harris' amendment will read: That the motion moved by member for North Shore be amended by omitting all words after "That" and inserting instead, "this House recognises that every member in the Parliament has a responsibility to act to end gambling harm and money laundering."

Dr JOE McGIRR (Wagga Wagga) (14:32:39):

By leave: The basic issue is gambling reform. I thank the member for North Shore for moving the motion for debate and further discussion on this issue. These machines are scientifically proven to manipulate human senses, prey upon the most vulnerable and those who can least afford to gamble. Just 1 per cent of gamblers whom we would classify as problem gamblers contribute vast amounts to the total gambling profits in the State of New South Wales. We have a business model that preys on the vulnerable. Money is hoovered out of the pockets of New South Wales residents by an electronic vacuum. This has significant and terrible impacts on problem addicts right across the State. Since campaigning on this issue, particularly at the last election, I was genuinely amazed at the number of people who sought me out to quietly say how this had affected their lives and how important it is to get this reform happening. The second reason for reform is that criminal networks are laundering billions of dollars through gambling machines—the multi-agency Project Islington report showed that. The third reason is that a mandatory and identity-linked cashless gaming system with set limits would close the money laundering loophole and significantly limit the impacts of problem gambling.

I acknowledge the former Premier, Dominic Perrottet, for his moral courage in this area. I believe his stance dramatically shifted this debate. He understood the importance of this issue and the need to get reforms underway. I have to say he worked very effectively with the crossbench. I do believe that the Premier and the Government now understand the importance of this issue. They have read the room on the need for reform. I welcome the constructive way in which they have worked with me, the member for Lake Macquarie, the member for Sydney in particular, and other members of the crossbench. I welcome the commitment of the Minister, the Hon. David Harris, who I genuinely believe wishes to drive poker machine reform.

I support and encourage an expansion of the cashless gaming trial to include more poker machines at more venues. The trial will be overseen by an independent panel, which will advise on technology, infrastructure, cost, impact on industry and employment, and options to reduce gambling harm. There should not be any unnecessary delay to the trial: The community expects progress on this issue and not at a glacial pace. However, I do accept that we need to do this right and, if that does take some extra time, so be it—as long as the commitment and actions remain genuine. I also welcome the other related gambling reforms, both legislative and regulatory, as promised by Labor in opposition. The reforms include bans on donations from clubs with poker machines to political parties, external signage for VIP gaming rooms being phased out, reducing cash limits for new machines from 1 July 2023 to $500, and reforming older machines and expanding the self-exclusion register statewide.

I have met with representatives of large clubs in Wagga Wagga with poker machines and with representatives of ClubsNSW. I believe they are aware of the issues and understand the need to change. I acknowledge that change must be a fair transition, especially for regional areas. These venues must be supported so that their doors stay open and jobs are not lost. They are often the centre of community life. We need to support them in this transition. At this point it is critical to continue to work with the Government to achieve these important reforms for our communities.

Ms FELICITY WILSON (North Shore) (14:36:51):

In reply: I thank all members who contributed to debate on my motion. It just shows how many people in the House are concerned about this issue. I thank the members for the electorates of Wyong, Sydney, Manly, Campbelltown, Newtown, Murray, Granville and Wagga Wagga for their contributions to debate. What we have heard in this debate is general agreement across all members of this House that action on poker machine reform is crucial—that is, action to address both the social harms of problem gambling and to address the crime and money laundering implications that have been revealed by the NSW Crime Commission's report. We are yet to see the full extent of the concerning impacts of problem gambling across New South Wales, but we continue to have more and more evidence.

Just last week we had more evidence about the significant profits that are being reaped by poker machines across New South Wales, with Liquor & Gaming showing that there had been an increase in poker machine profits of 40 per cent, or $1.2 billion, from the start of 2017 to 2022—and that is even while gaming machine numbers had dropped by 6.2 per cent. Although we have had an incredibly comprehensive conversation across our community, as the member for Wagga Wagga acknowledged, and there is strong support for these reforms, we see that the problem persists and it is potentially getting worse. While I agree with all members of this House that there is significant goodwill for an outcome, I remain concerned about the pace of that, and about the detail and focus of that. Today, if we were in a regime of the New South Wales Liberal-Nationals Government, we would have already had a road map underway to be set by the end of this year. The transition task force was due to commence in April 2023. We would have looked to have the road map for delivery of reforms in place by the end of 2023. I believe that that would have occurred.

We also would have expanded the current technology testing arrangements from 500 machines, which is all that Labor is committing to, to 2,000 machines this year. That work would already have been underway with a transition task force established that would encompass the police, Liquor and Gaming NSW, Treasury, Department of Customer Service and the Privacy Commissioner, and industry and harm minimisation representatives.

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